EK
Eleanor K

1 reviews | Active since Jun 2016

27 Sept 2017, 13:26

Stop harassing me

Every single day from morning till night the call centre phones me to my cell phone to my work phone and every time its a different person. I have send them an email to the following person: Team Administrator ********** ********** 132 Jan Smuts Avenue, Rosebank, 2193 P O Box 1409, Parklands, 2121 Tel : 011 ********** Direct : ********** Fax : 011 ********** ********** If they phone me they act as if they are phoning me for the first time. I told them on every conversation not to phone me at work but bet your life on it they still do it even late at night. I want to know how do they work as a team if the one do not know what the other one has already done????? Tmiya do not get back to me via email but they keep phoning me........why!!!!!!!!! What do you want from me??????? The only way of stopping this will be to lay a charge of harassment as they have no right to phone me all day. Please Brooks and Luyt train your consultans to do a better job because by harassing people you will not get the money faster but instead making them negative to pay. Because what ever the consultants still phone you none stop.

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Replies (19)
Brooks and Luyt
Brooks and Luyt's reply27 Sept 2017, 13:59
Official

We refer to the complaint received on 27 September 2017 and hereby confirm that we act on behalf of First National Bank.

We further confirm that the matter has been escalated to the manager overseeing the respective portfolio for investigation.

We will be in contact with the complainant in an attempt to resolve the issue and trust that this matter will be resolved amicably.

EK
Eleanor K's update27 Sept 2017, 14:06
Reviewer Update
Excuse me Woolworths????????? make sure of your facts and send me the signed section 58 (consent to judgement) i've had enough of this now. I will not just leave this matter as my employer has nothing to do with my personal life. You better act very fast on this as I will not answer any calls from your different numbers that I have saved on my cell phone.
EK
Eleanor K's update27 Sept 2017, 14:09
Reviewer Update
Correct your replies above as well I am now convinced that the consultants needs training
Brooks and Luyt
Brooks and Luyt's reply27 Sept 2017, 14:40
Official

Good day Ms Kruger

The message regarding Woolworths was posted in error. The Hello Peter Website is in process of removing this. Find directly below the correct response.

We will be in contact with the complainant in an attempt to resolve the issue and trust that this matter will be resolved amicably.

EK
Eleanor K's update27 Sept 2017, 14:56
Reviewer Update
Please can you in the mean time forward me the signed section 58 (consent to judgement) and untill this matter has been resolved please put a notice on my profile that your consultants do not phone me.
EK
Eleanor K's update27 Sept 2017, 15:34
Reviewer Update
I simply cant believe this Wilton Mabara just phoned me again with regards to this matter. I wonder if you people at Brooks Luyt really read this or is this just an automated reply. I said no more phone calls end of story until I have received the signed section 58 which gave permission to judgement. You are quick to phone and harass people but if these same people request compulsary documentation from you you simply just ignore them
EK
Eleanor K's update28 Sept 2017, 08:18
Reviewer Update
I am still waiting for a reply to my request you cannot assist me with this but still your consultants again phoned me twice last night. See my posting which i mentioned that I am not going to talk to them until my request has been met. Just in case you do not know what section 58 means I will copy it to you. Does the NCA prohibit you to rely on consent to judgment to collect an outstanding debt? Section 58 of the Magistrates Court Act allows debtors to sign a consent to judgment when a letter of demand or summons is served. This section provides creditors with a powerful tool to reduce the time and costs incurred when collecting outstanding debts and are an exceptional procedure whereby a creditor can obtain judgment without having to prove the claim. Various Magistrates’ Courts refused to grant a section 58 judgment based on reasoning that this is prohibited by the National Credit Act. In the case of African Bank Limited v Additional Magistrate Myambo NO and Others an order was sought regarding the application of section 58. The judge ruled that the NCA does not repeal section 58 and that credit providers can rely on it to obtain judgment in cases to which the NCA applies. In order to obtain a judgment by means of section 58, the creditor needs to comply with certain requirements, namely: • The section 58 requirements as per the Magistrates Courts Act; • The delivery of a section 129 (NCA) notice; • Compliance with section 130 (NCA). The summons or letter of demand served on the debtor must contain the allegation that the section 129 notice was delivered and a copy of the notice must be included. The section 129 notice must be in a clear and understandable language to enable the consumer to make an informed decision whether to sign the consent to judgment or not. The judge held that consent cannot be informed if the debtor is not aware of alternative legal remedies. The debtor must furthermore be in default of the credit agreement for at least 20 business days before the creditor can approach the court for judgment. It was further held that the Clerk of the court may refer the matter to the court in instances where there is uncer*****y as to whether the consumer has been afforded the full benefit of the protective measures contained in the NCA or where it is alleged that the consumer is over-indebted. The magistrate may then also interrogate debtors and request proof of any fact or document to assist the magistrate in granting the order. The judge made mention of the importance of cost-effective and speedy debt collection. Provided that the provisions of section 58 and those of the NCA are app**** properly and with due regard to the parties’ rights, it is in the interests of credit providers and of consumers that the procedure be utilised.
EK
Eleanor K's update28 Sept 2017, 08:23
Reviewer Update
Please send me the section 58 which I have signed. If you do not have such a signed document please refer to the credit act which states that all debts older than three (3) years are prescribed debt and that you cannot harass any one to pay it. I want this matter sorted out today your consultants have lots of spare time to go to the file and send me a copy if they had lots of work they wont phone the same person up to 5 times a day.
EK
Eleanor K's update28 Sept 2017, 09:14
Reviewer Update
Still no reply I am sure before you harass people you must have a file with all the documentation on hand. What is the delay now I am waiting for the section 58 which I signed!!!!!!!!!!!
EK
Eleanor K's update29 Sept 2017, 08:08
Reviewer Update
I am still waiting for the signed section 58. Carmen that email you have send me means nothing. Please just forward me the requested signed section 58.
EK
Eleanor K's update29 Sept 2017, 08:26
Reviewer Update
The Prescribed Debt Amendment When the National Credit Act was amended in March 2015 to prohibit the collection of prescribed debt, we all breathed a sigh of relief. The amendment was not introduced as a way for people to shirk their debt commitments. But rather because it’s not fair to be contacted by a debt collector out of the blue, demanding payment for an ancient debt. What collectors do is they buy old written-off debts and add years of interest and penalty fees to them. Then they phone you up and demand payment. Previously, the Prescription Act did not prohibit collectors from trying to get people to pay off prescribed debt. A prescribed debt is a debt that has been dormant for three or more years. You have not made any payments, acknowledged or received any summons relating to the debt. On the other hand, home loans and student loans only prescribe after 30 years. If you were not aware of debt prescription, did not raise it as a defence, and agreed to pay up, your hands were tied and you had to cough up for the old debt, interest and penalty fees included. Accordingly, it was not in the best interest of the booming debt collection industry to make consumers aware of prescription, as millions were to be made from those in the dark. There was reason to be excited about this section of the National Credit Amendment Act, as it meant we were protected from having to pay prescribed debt, and not just those of us who were aware of it. Open to Interpretation Demands for payment of prescribed debt should be a thing of the past. But, the truth is the demands have not stopped since the implementation of the amendment. And those of us who do question collectors about why they are demanding payment for a prescribed debt are told that ‘it’s complicated’ and instructed to come into their offices to discuss the matter – offices that are often hundreds of kilometres away. The fact of the matter is the amendment remains open to interpretation, according to the Credit Ombud. Collectors have found a loophole in the rule that a prescribed debt cannot be collected “where the consumer raises the defence of prescription, or would reasonably have raised the defence of prescription had the consumer been aware of such a defence in response to a demand”. Collectors argue that the amendment does not protect consumers who were aware of or made aware of the defence of prescription. “So, where the credit provider can prove that the consumer was aware of the existence of the defence, or was made aware of the defence of prescription and did not raise the defence of prescription, the reactivation and continued collection of prescribed debts is not prohibited.” The Demands Continue Accordingly, many collectors continue to demand payment for prescribed debt, by adding a paragraph or two. Some collectors will send you an SMS, referring you to their website to acquaint yourself with prescribed debt. And if you don’t get clued up and then agree to make a payment, you lose the prescription defence – based on this interpretation. The National Credit Regulator (NCR) disagrees with this interpretation. “Whether the consumer knows about the prescription defence or not, the debt has prescribed and there should be no collection or re- activation of it,” said an NCR spokesman. Any collector attempting to collect prescribed debt is “circumventing the application of this provision and misleading consumers,” he explained. Clearly this amendment and its interpretations need to be challenged in a court of law. Low-income households spend as much as 77% of their income on servicing debt. How many of us are still servicing old, inflated debt that should have prescribed years ago? If you suspect that you are paying a prescribed debt, which you are not legally obliged to pay, get in touch with us today for immediate assistance.
EK
Eleanor K's update29 Sept 2017, 08:30
Reviewer Update
WHAT IS A SECTION 129 NOTICE? The following tips will help you better understand what a section 129 notice: First step in the legal process and should be taken seriously by credit consumers to prevent further legal action It is the notice issued in terms of section 129 of the National Credit Act advising a consumer that they are in arrears of a certain amount in unpaid installment(s) at a given date. The credit provider or an Attorney appointed by the credit provider may issue notice according to Sec 129 of the NCA at any time after the client has been in arrears for more than 20 business days. The credit provider reserves the right to issue the Section 129 at an time after 20 business of being in arrears The credit provider may not proceed with any legal action without having fully comp**** with NCA requirements as contemplated in Sec 129 & Sec 130 It is important to know how to identify a section 129 notice: In order to fulfill the general requirements of the notice the Sec 129 notice/ letter should possess a minimum of the following key elements: Name, ID and address of the consumer Clearly “dated” State the agreement which the client is in default and the specific amounts thereof; and Clearly indicate that the letter serves as “notice in terms of Section 129” State in no uncertain terms that the consumer is in default The intentions of the credit provider to enforce his rights as per the agreement Possible remedies to avoid enforcement of the credit agreement by the creditor Time frame available to institute remedies to avoid further legal action Valid notification of section 129: The Act prescribes the notification in Section 129(1): This notification can be broken down into the following notification criteria in order to be considered as valid: a)Notification of the consumer’s default should be given to the consumer. It is important and a precondition that the consumer be made aware of his default; and b)The notification should be in writing; and c)The notification should comprise a certain format, stating in no uncertain terms what the consumer’s rights and options are; and d)The notification should disclose the intent on the credit providers front to reconcile and negotiate a plan to help the consumer out of his default Section 129(1)(b) adds to the above mentioned criteria by stating that: a)Legal action may not be taken against a consumer in default if the notice as envisaged in section 129(1)(a) has not been delivered; and b)Legal action may not be taken against a consumer should the requirements as stated in Section 130 not be met Section 129 notice of the NCA is the start of legal action and should be taken very seriously to prevent further legal action: —It is always best to deal with the creditors in writing. Keep a copy of times, dates and contacts you have dealt with as this becomes a very important issue when consumers make arrangements, only for the creditors to proceed with the next legal step, a Summons. —Check the date that has been listed on the letter, to the date the letter was posted. It has been known that letters have been sent whereby the dates do not correspond. An example of this is the letter is dated 1 January 2011 but it was only sent on the 4 April 2011. —This letter also advises, that it is the creditors intentions to take further legal action. Creditors warn consumers that should this letter be ignored, they will enforce their rights to issue a summons which could result in a sale of execution on your home. A further warning is issued, when creditors advise that they intend to supply adverse information through to the credit bureaus. Make sure to keep yourself up to date on information regarding the section 129 notice.
EK
Eleanor K's update29 Sept 2017, 08:49
Reviewer Update
You can roll over and play dead when it comes to a credit card lawsuit. But what if just a little effort could get you a major win? I’ve seen thousands of people with judgments from the credit card company that filed a lawsuit against them. Rather than contend with the difficulties of mounting a defense, my clients – smart, honest folks – did nothing. As a result, they ended up in my office with garnishments, bank account freezes, and worse. When I ask, they tell me they didn’t fight because they didn’t see the point of doing so. The credit card company had more money, better lawyers, and seemingly deeper pockets. Why fight a credit lawsuit? It’s simple, really. The Other Side Is Unprepared Most law firms that represent credit card companies in lawsuits do no more advance planning than getting a computer file and dumping the information into a form Complaint to be sent off to the court. Whether the lawsuit is to be filed in Los Angeles, Pasadena, Brooklyn or the Bronx it’s all the same – the lawyer spits out the document, gets it filed, and hopes that you do nothing. If you decide to fight the credit card lawsuit, however, they’re totally unprepared for you. Suddenly, someone’s got to dig up a bunch of documents to prove up the case. They’ve got to send lawyers to court. They need to (gasp) read your Answer and other documents in order to figure out how to battle you. All this takes time. Lots of it. And that’s at a premium, because … Credit Card Lawyers Are Overburdened Each law firm files thousands of these cases each year, which is far more than they can reasonably handle – unless it’s reduced to a simple assembly-line cranking out documents on one side, default judgments on the other. All it takes is a printer and a few administrative employees to push that much paper through the door. The business model is based on most people defaulting on the credit card lawsuit so that they lawyers can begin a garnishment or freeze your bank account. High-volume, low-maintenance, high-profit. Once you stand up to fight, you’ve gotten in the way of a good thing. They need to do something to shut you down. Which is difficult, because … Credit Card Lawsuits Are Filled With Problems Credit card debts are sold repeatedly before a lawsuit is started against you. As we’ve discussed in the past, most of the time these sale transactions occur without any documentation being passed from seller to buyer. By the time someone files a lawsuit, the paperwork is nowhere to be found. Consequently, you can’t rely on what they say in the Complaint. Who really owns the debt? How did they calculate the balance due, and is it correct? Did they sue in the time period allowed by the law? Which state’s laws control the credit card agreement? They don’t know. Of course, they could find out. But why bother when … Settlement Or Dismissal Looks Like A Pretty Good Idea It’s like a poker game. Sue and get a default – a winner! Do it thousands of times a year – major winner! But spin the wheel and get someone who is willing to fight the credit card lawsuit? Cut your losses and either settle or dismiss the case entirely. In the Right Hands, A Fight Is A Better Idea If you get sued by a credit card company, you can do nothing and face the consequences. Or you can call a lawyer who knows how to defend the case and get a better result. Which sounds like a better idea to you?
Brooks and Luyt
Brooks and Luyt's reply29 Sept 2017, 10:44
Official

Dear Madam

The extract taken from the website of Debt Busters which you have incorporated in your complaint refers, to which we have included the link below for ease of reference.

http://www.debtbusters.co.za/faq/what-is-a-section-129-notice/

Kindly take note that the Section 129 notice preceding the summons that was served at the last address our client had on record as being that where you were domiciled, was sent to the latter address on the 04th of July 2011.

The above notice reached the Fichardt Park Post Office situate in Bloemfontein on the 11th of August 2011 and a notification was dispatched to the address concerned by the aforesaid branch of the Post Office, which action satisfied the requirements for delivery of the notice to you as contemplated in both Kubyana vs Standard Bank and Sebola vs Standard Bank.

Having considered the above facts, it is our contention that our client comp**** with all the relevant sections of the National Credit Act prior to it enforcing the credit agreement in question by way of further legal action, which view was upheld by the Magistrates’ Court when it granted judgment in our client’s favour in respect of the matter.

Kindly be advised accordingly.

Brooks and Luyt
Brooks and Luyt's reply29 Sept 2017, 11:07
Official

Dear Madam

The extract taken from the website of National Debt Advisors which you have incorporated in your complaint refers, to which we have included the link below for ease of reference. https://nationaldebtadvisors.co.za/consumer-rights/

Section 126B of the National Credit Amendment Act which came into force on the 13th of March 2015 determines that, “No person may continue the collection of, or re-activate a debt under a credit agreement to which this Act applies - which debt has been extinguished by prescription under the Prescription Act.”

Section 15 (1) of the Prescription Act states that, “The running of prescription shall be interrupted by the service on the debtor of any process whereby the creditor claims payment of the debt.”

Section 11 stipulates the periods of prescription associated with a judgment debt to be 30 years.

In light of the three sections above, the indebtedness to our client has not prescribed.

1) For the claim arising from account number *** a summons was served at the last address our client had on record as being that where you were domiciled.

Service was effected on 17 October 2011 in accordance with rules 9(3)(d) and/or 9(5) of the Rules Regulating the Conduct of Proceedings of Magistrates’ Courts of SA, which service fulfilled the interruption requirement as contemplated in Section 15 (1) of the Prescription Act.

2) Further to the above, after having considered the merits in question, judgment was granted in favour of our client by the Magistrate Court on or about the 06 February 2012 under Case number 26730/11, which interrupted prescription for a period of 30 years thereafter as per Section 11 of the Prescription Act.

Having considered the above facts, it is our contention that the indebtedness may lawfully be pursued seeing that all requirements as envisaged by both the National Credit Act and the Prescription Act have been comp**** with.

Kindly be advised accordingly.

EK
Eleanor K's update29 Sept 2017, 11:17
Reviewer Update
I dont want to hear your nonsense I want the signed documentation each and every signed slip as well as the section 58. Without my signature the above reply is invalid or do you want to proof me wrong. This is how collectors catch lots of people buying up written off debt and collecting the full balance plus interest. I have a copy of laws on interest too will post it now.
Brooks and Luyt
Brooks and Luyt's reply29 Sept 2017, 15:10
Official

Kindly be advised that judgment was neither obtained by way of the section 58, nor section 57 consent processes.

Judgment was granted due to you being in default of entering an appearance to defend the summons that was duly served, and which service need not be acknowledged by way of the signature of the recipient according to the rules of court.

Seeing that the summons was prosecuted to final judgment as contemplated in the Prescription Act, prescription was interrupted for a period of 30 years from the date of which the judgment was obtained.

Further to the above, the indebtedness was also acknowledged in writing by way of email in that an arrangement for repayment was concluded by you. The latter acknowledgement constitutes express acknowledgement of liability as contemplated in section 14 of the Prescription Act.

We are of the opinion that the only recourse available to you from a legal perspective, would be to apply for a rescission of the judgment subsequent to which, (and should the court decide to rescind the opposed application), you may enter an appearance to defend the summons.

As per your request our Attorney will contact you at 17:00 today to discuss the process and address any of your uncer*****ies.

EK
Eleanor K's update29 Sept 2017, 17:23
Reviewer Update
I am not interested in your stories go and preach else where I have logged a complaint with F N B we will take it from there
EK
Eleanor K's update02 Oct 2017, 09:07
Reviewer Update
tell your consultants to stop phoning me. What do they want from me???? Does the collector/sherrif have proof that they tried to deliver anything to me but could not find me???????????????????????????? Get your ducks in a row and send me the proof